MKV (ffmpeg) or MKV (MKVtoolnix)??

JLB2

Hi.

I usually save my downloads as h264 or h265 .mp4.

Today, I wanted to save a series episode as an .mkv. When I went to make that change in the settings page, I noticed I was given a choice of either saving the .mkv as an MKV (ffmpeg) or MKV (MKVtoolnix).

Which is the better choice? Is one a better quality file than the other?

I am experienced in using both ffmpeg and MKVToolnix; but am not sure why StreamFab would give me a choice of one or the other.

Can someone help me understand this?

Thank you.

JLB2

I downloaded the episode using both choices. Here is the media info for each:

FFMPEG
General
Unique ID :
Complete name :
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4
File size : 3.86 GiB
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Overall bit rate : 11.0 Mb/s
Frame rate : 23.976 FPS
Movie name :
Description :
Writing application : Lavf60.3.100
Writing library : Lavf60.3.100
Cover : Yes
ErrorDetectionType : Per level 1
Attachments : cover.png
DATE :
EPISODE_ID : 4
GENRE :
SEASON_NUMBER :
SHOW :

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Bit rate : 10.1 Mb/s
Width : 1 440 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 4:3
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.271
Stream size : 3.56 GiB (92%)
Writing library : AVC Coding
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
VENDOR_ID : [0][0][0][0]

Audio
ID : 2
Format : E-AC-3
Format/Info : Enhanced AC-3
Commercial name : Dolby Digital Plus
Codec ID : A_EAC3
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 640 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel layout : L R C LFE Ls Rs
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Bit depth : 32 bits
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 231 MiB (6%)
Title : English
Language : English
Service kind : Complete Main
Default : Yes
Forced : No
VENDOR_ID : [0][0][0][0]
Dialog Normalization : -31 dB
compr : -0.28 dB
dialnorm_Average : -31 dB
dialnorm_Minimum : -31 dB
dialnorm_Maximum : -31 dB

JLB2

And for the MKV (toolnix) option:

General
Unique ID :
Complete name :
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4
File size : 3.86 GiB
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Overall bit rate : 11.0 Mb/s
Frame rate : 23.976 FPS
Movie name :
Description :
Encoded date : 2024-12-02 08:36:38 UTC
Writing application : mkvmerge v68.0.0 ('The Curtain') 64-bit
Writing library : libebml v1.4.2 + libmatroska v1.6.4
Cover : Yes
Attachments : cover.png
DATE :
EPISODE_ID : 4
GENRE :
SEASON :
SHOW :

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, Reference frames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Bit rate : 10.3 Mb/s
Width : 1 440 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 4:3
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.276
Stream size : 3.64 GiB (94%)
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709

Audio
ID : 2
Format : E-AC-3
Format/Info : Enhanced AC-3
Commercial name : Dolby Digital Plus
Codec ID : A_EAC3
Duration : 50 min 30 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 640 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel layout : L R C LFE Ls Rs
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 231 MiB (6%)
Title : English
Language : English
Service kind : Complete Main
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Dialog Normalization : -31 dB
compr : -0.28 dB
dialnorm_Average : -31 dB
dialnorm_Minimum : -31 dB
dialnorm_Maximum : -31 dB

JLB2

I don't any appreciable difference between the two.

So why be given the two different options?

Germania

mkv as an MKV (ffmpeg) or MKV (MKVtoolnix).

Which is the better choice? Is one a better quality file than the other?
JLB2

I don't know why both are offered
probably there have been isolated problems with both in the past

But with (outdated) mkvtoolnix there were more frequent problems ..
especially when using multiple subtitles and/or remux into file
or with titles ended with mp4, mkv .. - see also here
or sometimes files show wrong Quicktime Format - like here

JLB2

I don't know why both are offered probably there have been isolated problems with both in the past

But with (outdated) mkvtoolnix there were more frequent problems ..
especially when using multiple subtitles and/or remux into file
or with titles ended with mp4, mkv .. - see also here
or sometimes files show wrong Quicktime Format - like here
Germania

Thanks for the information. I appreciate it.

I can definitely understand when you said ". . . with (outdated) mkvtoolnix there were more frequent problems . . ." being an issue. That was very true with mkvtoolnix a few years back.

As I mentioned in my op, I usually d/l movies/episodes as .mp4. This was a very rare time that I wanted an mkv.

Cats4U

Both mkvmerge and mp4box can be updated to their latest version in SF.
Latest mkvmerge.exe is version 88 and is part of mkvtoolnix found at https://mkvtoolnix.download/downloads.html#windows
mp4box is part of GPAC. The latest version of GPAC is 2.5 (nightly). Easiest way to get it is to download the gpac_latest_head_win64.exe permalink at https://gpac.io/downloads/gpac-nightly-builds/
Install both programs to their own directories and copy mkvmerge.exe and mp4box.exe to C:\Program Files\DVDFab\StreamFab

MrKrawk

Both mkvmerge and mp4box can be updated to their latest version in SF.
Latest mkvmerge.exe is version 88 and is part of mkvtoolnix found at https://mkvtoolnix.download/downloads.html#windows
mp4box is part of GPAC. The latest version of GPAC is 2.5 (nightly). Easiest way to get it is to download the gpac_latest_head_win64.exe permalink at https://gpac.io/downloads/gpac-nightly-builds/
Install both programs to their own directories and copy mkvmerge.exe and mp4box.exe to C:\Program Files\DVDFab\StreamFab
Cats4U

By looking at the file sizes of mkvmerge, I question why a release from October is not present in our SF directory on a program that was literally from a couple of days ago.

I guess the same reason they infrequently update yt dlp. When they do, the release notes make it look like they performed a miracle and patched 25 different sites.

Germania

.. why a release from October is not present in our SF directory on a program that was literally from a couple of days ago.
MrGrackle

That's a good question - Cats4U has already suggested this several times

The last post about the external tools (+ Updater) that I remember was by Sebastian001 - here
Topic closed - without response

JLB2

Both mkvmerge and mp4box can be updated to their latest version in SF.
Latest mkvmerge.exe is version 88 and is part of mkvtoolnix found at https://mkvtoolnix.download/downloads.html#windows
mp4box is part of GPAC. The latest version of GPAC is 2.5 (nightly). Easiest way to get it is to download the gpac_latest_head_win64.exe permalink at https://gpac.io/downloads/gpac-nightly-builds/
Install both programs to their own directories and copy mkvmerge.exe and mp4box.exe to C:\Program Files\DVDFab\StreamFab
Cats4U

Interesting information. I never considered this before (and I've been using Fab products since late-2005).

When I first viewed the mediainfo for the the two files we've been discussing, I was somewhat astounded that the mkvmerge version in SF was 68. I've been using (extensively) mkvtoolnix for years and have had version 88 in my 'toolbox' since it was first released.

I've followed your suggestion and updated both for my current version of SF.

Thanks for the excellent (and relevant!) information. :)

MrKrawk

6208 installs version 68 of mkvmerge when version 88 has been out awhile.
It also installs 6567K version of mp4box, while the latest nightly build has a file size of 416K. The latest 'official' build dates back to April 17th and there is no actual indication of when the latest nightly build was made.

nightmaresdesire

Hi.

I usually save my downloads as h264 or h265 .mp4.

Today, I wanted to save a series episode as an .mkv. When I went to make that change in the settings page, I noticed I was given a choice of either saving the .mkv as an MKV (ffmpeg) or MKV (MKVtoolnix).

Which is the better choice? Is one a better quality file than the other?

I am experienced in using both ffmpeg and MKVToolnix; but am not sure why StreamFab would give me a choice of one or the other.

Can someone help me understand this?

Thank you.
JLB2

They are both just muxing tools that achieve the same results. Pick either one it wont matter and you will still get your MKV file. It doesn't have an effect on quality, it's just which tool to do the muxing with. The only reason I can think of to offer both is for redundancy. If one for some reason could not or would not work, you have another one to choose from.

JLB2

They are both just muxing tools that achieve the same results. Pick either one it wont matter and you will still get your MKV file. It doesn't have an effect on quality, it's just which tool to do the muxing with. The only reason I can think of to offer both is for redundancy. If one for some reason could not or would not work, you have another one to choose from.
nightmaresdesire

Great info, thanks!

AGuyWithAComputer

Personally,

I download as .mp4 with srt for subs, then remux into mkv with mkvtoolnix. Then convert or trim to h265 as needed with ffmpeg all using a post processing script I started long ago. by trim I mean cut the netflix budump from the beginning and the long silent credits from the end.