Many Audio & Video sync issues using h264/ac3

[rfh]

I have seen several posts in the forums regarding video and audio sync issues but seam to still have problems on about a third of my cd.'s. I ha tried every released version since the july 28 flavor (6.0.4.0, 6.0.7.0) a couple beta releases (6.1.1.2 and 6.1.1.8) and today I tried 6.1.2.0 all with the same results. I am attempting to create content for my apple tv using the included profile (4096 kbps for video and 160kbps audio dolby prologic II and single pass). I usually use dvd to mobile right from the cd, but I have also tried dvd to a tsp-video and an iso image then to apple tv again all with the same results. My furstratio level get getting very high at this point so can someone tell me why I don't seam to be able to get this to work? Titles I have been tryng are Wizzard of Oz, Jurrasic Park, Forrest Gump, Pineapple Express all with no luck. I can take the iso that fab makes ad burn another cd that is in perfect sync so the problem is clearly in the conversation to h264 for the apple tv. Any help here would be greatly appreciated.

[rfh]

An example tried a couple days ago excerpt from fab internal log follows.

DVDFab 6.1.1.2 (2009/10/22 04:00:58)

0m 43.06s: detected dvd
0m 43.06s: iso W:\Video\New Video\MainMovie\FOREST.iso
0m 43.06s: video dvd 1
0m 43.06s: volume label FOREST
0m 43.09s: got copyright 0 0
0m 43.18s: got udf/iso
0m 43.21s: got discinfo
0m 46.93s: got dvdinfo

[GregiBoy]

First I would try a couple of things:-

Try reducing your bitrate back to about 1500. I think 4096 could be too high and could be causing the synch problem.
Try playing a problem file on your PC. Does the synch problem exist there also?

I would also try another couple of profiles. One that I use all the time is the generic.mp4.h264.audiocopy one and always choose the Dolby 5.1 soundtrack which maintains perfect synch on my Samsung TV but I don't know whether Apple TV supports DD5.1 sound.

It is worth a try.

[rfh]

Gregiboy, thanks for the response. So far I have tried the following: 1) I changed the apple tv profile to stereo (from dolby prologic II), that has corrected the wizard of oz but has NOT helped pineapple express or forrest gump. I'm in the process of trying the generic profile you suggested. I'll post again when I have results. I'm hesitant to reduce the video bit rates as the atv can handle up to 5 mbps and I'd like best quality possible ad I have plenty of disk space. But if the generic profile doesn't do it I'll give it a try for debug purposes.

[GregiBoy]

Don't be hesitant to try reducing your bitrate.

The way that I arrived at the 1100 figure was through intense testing on my 52" Samsung TV just using a few chapters of different movies until I arrived at what I felt gave me acceptable quality.

I do sneak the bitrate up to 1500 for fast action movies.

A general comment on the bitrate !!!! higher is not necessarily better.

This is a very subjective topic and you really have to find what you are happy with.

My suggestion as a test, do the same chapters at 512, 1024, 2048, 3064 & 4096 bit rate and view the results and see if you can pick the difference.

Also get some friends/family to do the same and note down the results also taking into account the file sizes.

[rfh]

More Info

GregiBoy;

I have tried the generic h.264 profile using 2048 bitrate, that was a disaster, worst sync problem ever. I tried again at 1024bps and it was close to acceptable (I shouldn't have to settle for something however). I tried using the "standard" frame rate of 29.97 instead of reducing to 23.97 fps all to no avail. I also played with the audio rates trying stereo and dolby as well as 128kbps and 160 kbps without success. Finally went back to Handbrake and at this point it has flawlessly converted two of my many problem files from fab created iso images. It seams to handle bit rates just fine although I have not exhaustively tested it, after all I'm interested in results not spending days testing. The fact that at least initially handbrake has successfully transcoded the files tells me this is really a fab issue that needs work. This along with other folks audio/video issues it would seam to indicate that it is time for the developers to have a look into this area. While handbrake is pretty slow at least thus far it has provided consistent results. While I don't want to make a career out of experimenting if you or anyone can think of a couple things to try beyond what I've already done I'm game to have another go at it since I would really like to have a one stop solution

[ting]

hi,

I have "Pineapple Express", I will do the test for this disc first.

thanks report.

[rfh]

Ting:
thanks for the reply. Hopefully pineapple express will give you the same issues as me. It seams I have some problem o most of my disks, usually it is minimal and can only be detected if I look closely but on the disks (wizard of oz, jurassic park, forrest gump, pineapple express, notting hill) it seams pretty bad. I have been able to make iso images and then disks from them that are perfect. I'm trying to archive my entire collection of several hundred into apple tv compatible files at highest bitrates for audio and video possible so I can let the disks die off. At ay rate you have the makings of a great product here, keep up the good work!!!

ron

[tar]

Have ripped about 20 movies from PAL DVD since upgrading to 6.1.2.5, have synch issues on about two-thirds of them. On the movie Bolt, the lipsynch is out by more than a second by the end of the movie.

Am using the AppleTV profile (h264+aac), with most settings at defaults:
1500kps, 25fps, no deinterlacing, two pass (not default), 720x or 912x res, 128k audio.
The audio is set at Dolby Prologic II downmix (the default), but I have also experimented with normal stereo, and have found the problems remain.
Also, re-ripping a movie with a problem generally yields the same reuslt, with very minor differences.

The ripping platform is a fast QuadCore extreme with 8gb ram and Windows 7 x64. The problems are not playback specific, as the output exibits the same problem when played back in Windows Media Player, Quicktime (on several machines) or on an iPhone.

Please folks, accept that there is an issue and start investigating it seriously!

[triggerx]

I'll pile on as well.... there's a section to post "A/V Sync Issues".... but first of all, it's hard to tell if anything has been confirmed by the developers, or if anything's being worked on. Also, like others posting here, since upgrading to 6.2.0.5, I get sync issues with about 2/3rds of the movies I convert, so it's pointless for me to go post all the information about EVERY sync issue I have in the sticky. I remember about a year ago having severe sync issues, and then they finally went away, and I've been sync-trouble free for a long time... it's a shame to see the problem is back. FWIW, using PS3 Profile, mp4(h264 + aac), 2-pass encoding, 3072 bitrate, framerate same-as-source, bitrate 128kbps, Dolby ProLogic II. I've been using the same profile for over a year now with no changes.... the only thing is that I've upgraded to "stable" DVDFab's as they came out. I've also tried on another computer here (both XPSP3) to make sure the install hadn't gone bad.... same sync issues on the same movies. Also, FWIW, some of the movies start out in sync, and lose sync at exactly the 1Hour mark.... which was the same thing I saw in the builds last year that had sync issues.

[bnewbold]

Possible workaround and root cause

Hey TriggerX,

Thanks for the great info. I've been experiencing issues like yours for some time now and it just seems some discs are more susceptible than others.

After talking with Wendy in tech support for DVDFab, she reminded me of a workaround that you can perform:

1. Rip the disc to your HDD. Use DVD to DVD mode, and just rip right to a folder on your HDD.
2. Rip FROM the HDD folder to .h264 or whatever you usually do. In the source section just select the folder that was created in step 1. All the rest of the settings are up to you, as you normally would do.

I will generally rip the full disc, remove PGCs and use DVD9 for 100% quality.. all selections in DVD2DVD mode. That way I get more or less an uncompressed DVD with everything, right on my HDD.

This two step process is a few minutes more and eats up the HDD space with temporary files, but it gets the job done. Some of those discs that just would never rip using the usual method, easily fall to this one.
When ripping my 400+ DVD collection I found that 1/4 - 1/3 of the discs would ONLY rip, using DVDFab and the 2-step method.

SO That's the workaround part. The clicking, popping and audio sync issue is likely due to something going wrong during the layer transition. I don't know for certain but most discs will split a movie at the 1-hour mark (or so) and continue on the next layer of the media. This could be the source of the problem and I've alerted tech support to see if they would look into the issue further. It may actually not be their fault too.. some DVD readers just don't work that well. I have an HD-DVD reader that is pretty flaky sometimes, whereas my generic DVD-RW reads like a champ, every time, all the time.

SO, go figure. Give the 2-step method a shot and see what you get.

Good luck!!

B

[triggerx]

Thanks for the response, and it is very helpful and informative... however, that's the exact method I've been using for years now... same exact thing... ripping completely to HDD first... and never an issue (except for builds that actually had issues).... and am getting the same behavior in the recent couple builds.

[GregiBoy]

Well, I just run my standard tests that usually show problems with audio sync through the latest 6.2.1.5 beta.

These are "Deja Vu" & "Paul Macartney - Live at the Cavern Club" and will always show me whether there is a problem with the generic.avi.h264.audiocopy and the generic.avi.xvid.audiocopy profiles.

Both are in perfect sync played on a variety of players.

[Ozzie]

A/V sync is something that has been haunting a lot of programs that encode. I remember sending Fengtao video clips back and forth so many times with little to no results for a long time. I found that mkv file has giving me the least A/V syn issues with
avi and moh(H.264) being the worst. I really hope that one day this is fixed, but I am not holding my breath on it anytime soon.

[signals]

I have not tried the last two releases of DVDFab yet with DVD to Mobile, but I play my conversions on my Archos and my LG cellphone and with VLC on my PC and I can't remember the last time I had any sync isssues. H264+AAC/MP4.